Mia Ferraina (she/her): Okay welcome, we're very excited to get started, I wanna start with some introductions of our panelists and really hear a little bit more about their career paths so. Mia Ferraina (she/her): they'll each kind of give their extended introduction. Which official question is: share an overview of your path from Cornell to your current position. What set you on this path towards public service? Mia Ferraina (she/her): and whoever feel so moved can be the first one. Won't put anyone on the spot. George Hornedo: hi everybody, my name is George Hornedo George Hornedo: I'm a Arts and Sciences  2013 alum. Thanks to Katie and Mia for- for having me and the rest of the group and Nice to speak to everyone. Currently i'm an attorney. George Hornedo: At law firm here in DC where I do federal affairs work, so the way I kind of describe it is that i'm the firm's liaison to the Biden administration. In terms of my path you know from Cornell in on. George Hornedo: immediately upon graduated from cornell I got my masters in education policy from Harvard. George Hornedo: And then, after that I joined the Obama Administration as a political appointee at the Department of Justice that kind of came about from a number of. George Hornedo: Obama world internships during my time at Cornell. Following my time at DOJ I went to Clinton campaign headquarters worked on the delegate operation. George Hornedo: came back to DC to start law school at George Washington university during law school continue to to work part time, both on the Clinton campaign transition team, you know pre elect. George Hornedo: For a DNC race, for voting rights organization etc. Following graduation, you know I worked for mayor Pete Buttigieg's presidential campaign. George Hornedo: As his national delegate director and the national deputy political director, you know, after that, after he dropped out I took a contract with the Obama foundation. George Hornedo: Doing outreach and engagement for police reform initiative, then join the Biden campaign in the general doing voter protection. George Hornedo: And then I found myself at the law firm where I am now and learned a lot and happy to answer any you know specific questions that may come up around any of those experiences, but that's a little bit of an overview. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): awesome thanks George well i'm happy to go next it's delightful- delightful to be here with all of you. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): And so Mia and katie, in particular, thank you for organizing and I would be remiss if I didn't start by saying we're in. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): the midst of a legend here at the Einhorn Center enjoys music, and so I am loyal to Joyce Muchan, as we all are, I think. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): I think you know we're all very lucky to be mentored by her and so just a shout out to you Joyce for all that you've done for Cornell and all the students nice so nice to see you. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): i'm maybe the the Gray hair here on the panel so thankfully it's hiding on the side of my head, but I graduated in 2001. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): In Economics and Urban Planning, and I think as Mia described, when we were talking about public service, think about it a little bit more expansive my experience, because i've been firmly in kind of the nonprofit and philanthropic sector for most of my career. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): i'm currently Vice President at Fidelity Charitable, which is the nation's largest donor advised fund sponsor. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): For those of you that don't know what a donor advised fund is think about it like a charitable checking account. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): You give to a donor advised fund like Fidelity Charitable and then you get your tax deduction and an intern you recommend your grants. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): From your accounts to other nonprofits so we're just we're an intermediary and I advise donors on their charitable giving strategies, but just to kind of. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): show the arc of my career and Joyce and George know this, but like i'm just following my better half who's also been in public service and hopefully she can be on the career panel later I started. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): In the field, I worked at Oxfam America, which is a nonprofit. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): Doing micro finance works so getting really small loans to poor women in developing countries that didn't have any collateral to help jumpstart their businesses and did that, for a couple of years. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): got kind of exposed to policy and advocacy work at Oxfam and decided that law school might be a good calling for me. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): I went to law school and following law school, practice for a few years. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): But that wasn't my calling I thought law school is really just a means to an end and really wanted to go back into the international development sphere. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): And so, thankfully, applied to the bill and Melinda Gates Foundation and found an opportunity there, so I was there for nine years. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): and basically had two phases to my career there one one phase for six years was basically helping the Gates Foundation partner with other major donor governments on international aid issues. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): I think you all know that you know foreign assistance is a very small sliver of the overall budget, but there's no natural. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): kind of constituency for it, so we were trying to promote the benefits of foreign assistance, but then also partner with you know groups like USAID in government. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): And the equivalence in other G7 and G20 countries to kind of get global health and development stuff across. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): All the more important now that we see that we're on, you know, hopefully, the tail end of Covid but laying the groundwork for things like vaccine equity and vaccine access and things like that. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): And then the second phase of my career at Gates was working on the philanthropic partnerships team, which is. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): Basically, responsible for trying to encourage more and better a charitable giving both with high net worth donors, as well as everyday givers. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): And that's how I kind of found my path to Fidelity Charitable so that's kind of the quick and dirty on me and I look forward to getting to know you all um maybe i'll hand it to Tori next. Tory Bredt AAP '09: Hi everyone. Thank you so much Mia, thank you Katie this is really exciting I wish I had a panel like this, when I was an undergrad so. Tory Bredt AAP '09: Yes, I currently work in the New York City Department of Education. I work for a local government. I'm a city worker. Tory Bredt AAP '09: And I am a director of communications and I do all of our state and local liaison work for teacher evaluation, so I do all of the fun policy and legislative work. Tory Bredt AAP '09: To ensure that we keep our teachers accountable and also as a former teacher myself I try to keep it in mind that. Tory Bredt AAP '09: It is not just about the the legalese it's also about the day to day practice that make sure that our students and our- our kids are getting the best education that they can get in New York City. Tory Bredt AAP '09: And so I my career path, I was an Urban Studies major as an undergrad at Cornell in Architecture, Art and Planning and when I was graduating I became a. Tory Bredt AAP '09: Teach for America core Member, so I was involved with teach for America as an undergrad I was a campus campaign coordinator, and so I got to learn a lot about TFA while I was an undergrad. Tory Bredt AAP '09: And naturally I did TFA after I graduated and I taught in Brooklyn in Brownsville for three years, I taught at a charter school there.Uncommon Schools is the name of the Charter and we're a really. Tory Bredt AAP '09: awesome charter network. Super high performing, incredible administer- incredible school leadership incredible amount of observation and training and support. Lots of resources lots of financial resources, I was, I was really in. Tory Bredt AAP '09: I was in-  in a great place for it to be a teacher and after three years, and after getting my masters in education, because as. Tory Bredt AAP '09: In New York state, you have to get a Masters to be a teacher, which is, I think, really interesting, and a point to consider if you're interested in teaching in New York. Tory Bredt AAP '09: And, and so I ended up taking a position with the New York City Department of Education in their central administration offices, because I found I thought that it was. Tory Bredt AAP '09: Really valuable the amount of observation and feedback I got as a teacher, I progressed really fast, because I had a school leader in my classroom every day, giving me, really, really strong. Tory Bredt AAP '09: Really specific feedback, so that I could support my kids um, and so I thought that the rest of the city should do that too, including the all of the public school teachers. Tory Bredt AAP '09: And so I came in at around the time of race to the top, which was a really interesting federal initiative. Tory Bredt AAP '09: And yeah I started working on different pilots helping with teacher EVAL and after 10 years i'm still in it and i'm still working on it and we're still making it better and better every day. Tory Bredt AAP '09: And i've sort of grown over the course of my career within the government to ensure that there were different opportunities promotion opportunities civil service exams, like all of the stuff to ensure that I, you know could. Tory Bredt AAP '09: get to the position i'm in now and yeah i'm very excited to talk about city service and government and i'm looking forward to meeting all of you so thanks for having me. Mia Ferraina (she/her): Alright, last but not least, Stephanie you're up. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: yeah hi everyone Thank you again to Mia and Katie for arranging this to echo what Tory said, this is something that I wish I had when I was undergrad. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: And my story isn't quite as long as these folks I graduated in 2019. I was CAL's graduate. An Animal Science major and a Business minor but always had an interest in policy. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: and I came here to Washington DC in 2018 to be an intern and after graduation, graduated without a job. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: And you know, comparing myself to many of my friends in Finance, which I think we'll discuss later that was not typical for many of them. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: But I came here in 2019 I started out working for my congresswoman from my home district in upstate New York Congresswoman Elise Stefanik. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: I was a policy advisor for her on Agricultural and Environmental issues, and I also did some communications work for her. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: Over the course of about two years and then joined my current bosses team Congressman Dan Newhouse, who is from central Washington represents Washington's fourth district, and is also Stephanie McBath CALS '19: The chairman of the Congressional Western Caucus so my day to day job really just depends on whatever my boss, is doing. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: He sits on the Appropriations Committee, the House Appropriations Committee, so I handle his legislative branch appropriations which funds, all of the operations here on the hill. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: And I also handle his energy and water probes portfolio, as well as that portfolio more broadly. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: My boss is district is very unique in that he has a lot of agricultural interests, which was my original passion and food and he's a farmer himself so that's really fascinating. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: behind me, is a map of the hanford nuclear reservation, so we handle all of the DOE funding for the cleanup operation. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: That exists and has existed out there for decades and will continue to exist for decades to come, so i've had a really interesting learning curve just in the last few months, I also handle education, healthcare. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: A number of other domestic issues for my boss, and by no means, am I, an expert in any of those areas but. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: My real you know my purpose at the end of the day is to represent whatever his constituents interests are and his interests, and you know, ultimately, we answer to them so. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: it's been really fascinating to learn about the West coming from the Northeast myself and i'm looking forward to, hopefully, many more years here on the hill. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: In whatever capacity I can to kind of further the agenda of agriculture and food but also just rural America is something that i'm just passionate about so it's great to be here and look forward to a really good discussion with all of you today. Mia Ferraina (she/her): Wonderful. alright well Thank you so much all for Mia Ferraina (she/her): giving us a little overview of your path um I think what i'm sensing kind of broadly is. Mia Ferraina (she/her): Everyone wanted to do some kind of good wasn't necessarily sure exactly how they wanted to accomplish that and. Mia Ferraina (she/her): has tried a few different things along the way, and probably will continue to experiment with other things, and that is kind of the beauty of public service, I think there's lots of ways to make an impact in the world, so. Mia Ferraina (she/her): Thank you all for sharing that. I want to transition a little bit to maybe a more abstract question about some of what Stephanie was just alluding to of okay everyone here was really looking at careers that were. Mia Ferraina (she/her): Maybe more. Mia Ferraina (she/her): Service minded or like values oriented, however, you want to think of it, maybe compared to some of your peers that might have either been interested in corporate or had more like financially specific goals. Mia Ferraina (she/her): So there can be some difference in experience, depending on what kind of sector you're going into so i'm curious to hear from you all, what that was like and maybe what advice you have for students. Mia Ferraina (she/her): Balancing that. George Hornedo: I mean, for me it was. George Hornedo: You know, was since I when I was 10 you know watching the you know. George Hornedo: Gore presidential debates and writing you know journal entries for school about it, or you know going and helping in the mail room for like a local mayoral candidate, and you know either. George Hornedo: This space has always kind of been my interest area, so it was it was very kind of intentional about about continuing in in that area, and so you think about a lot of the. George Hornedo: Students that Cornell or you know peer schools that you know are very A type to just even be there right. So if you don't have that sort of. George Hornedo: You know passion that you already have right. George Hornedo: And you go in and you're looking for that passion and it's often too easy to just say Okay, what are all the other A type people doing. What's the most prestigious thing? George Hornedo: it's let me do this business Fraternity you know, let me then you know go through the process and try and go to like a McKinsey Bain BCG or whatever the big bracket- George Hornedo: bracket banks are and things like that, and so it's too easy to fall into all that, which is also fine, but you know, for me it was trying not to be distracted. George Hornedo: By the unlimited you know number of choices that there are to university like cornell but really you know move forward on the areas that I would that I was interested in. George Hornedo: Trying to learn more about it and that's why the Public Service Center to me was was such a formative experience and you know, like Nageeb mentioned, you know Joyce you know I consider my Cornell mom. George Hornedo: Knowing that Joyce's on student time you know, most of our times catching up or after midnight, which is done in the office and. George Hornedo: Joyce taught me a lot about you know service, and you know doing things the right way and being truly involved in the Community and getting to know the issues at a grassroots level. George Hornedo: You know, and not drive by services, she always references which I imagine you all constantly here and so. George Hornedo: You know that's kind of how I saw it just you know not keeping blinders on being open to other opportunities, but using my time at Cornell both you know within campus but also with the summers and internships to kind of explore my passions formally. Mia Ferraina (she/her): yeah I want to add one other thing that maybe some others can weave in too because I appreciate that Mia Ferraina (she/her): kind of like experiential experimenting that George just described, I think one of the questions that some people had just even in the registration form was like how do I Mia Ferraina (she/her): navigate or balance like wanting to make an impact, but also needing a Mia Ferraina (she/her): Good paycheck and I think we all know, you can make a living, that is comfortable working in public service but you're not getting 100 K job offer straight out of the College of engineering, you know, this is a different kind of situation so if anyone can sort of speak to the  financial piece Tory Bredt AAP '09: I think, for me it was it was telling  that when I, and this is- this is different for every single like where you go in the country, but. Tory Bredt AAP '09: My fiance at the time was is an accountant, and he was making less than me my first year as a teacher and I got my summers off and my work life balance so it's well my work life balance was- teaching is tough. Tory Bredt AAP '09: I had no work life balance, but I had my summers off, so I think that, like it's it's it's a matter of your you have to sort of figure out also with your your time is valuable. Tory Bredt AAP '09: And I think like for me currently the work life balance that I have is. Tory Bredt AAP '09: So much better than almost every person that I that I know, like, I have a reliable stable job that is really in like I know that i'm doing great work and i'm having like I get to like pursue my passions and. Tory Bredt AAP '09: I have fantastic work life balance, and I think that that means more to me than a paycheck. Tory Bredt AAP '09: And over the course of time, you do get increases and you do get raises and, like those are all really important pieces and pensions and all of these like wonderful financial things too, so I think you can't have both. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): i'm happy to underscore with tori said I think it's. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): You know, let me say a friend at the beginning that some of us may have the privilege like rather coming out of undergrad as I did so i'm calling that privilege of not having any debt so. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): Without having debt, you know, sometimes that can be a major consideration and what drives kind of your decision making early on. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): You know, when I graduated in 2001 for sure, like you know those those consulting firms were enticing they are offering $53,000 and $55,000 salaries, compared to like 30 in the public sector or in the nonprofit sector and that seems like a significant gap when you're first starting your career. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): What I will say, though, is that you know, everybody here is probably dedicated to their craft, whatever that craft will be. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): And I think you will have the opportunity to grow in whether that's the government sector or the non for profit sector and. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): Undoubtedly, you will be making enough to be comfortable and have that work life balance that tori described. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): Ultimately, you know for longevity like I saw plenty of my colleagues, that graduated at the same time as me start at consulting start in other places, but get burned out after a few years. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): And I was able to kind of sustain, because what drove me was kind of a purpose and mission that kind of took precedence over financial. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): kind of abundance and and just knowing that like pathways existed to be able to be financially secure in those places so and you have to remember to like. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): You know, even though that private sector salary might be a kind of enticing and luring luring you that whether it's government or the nonprofit sector, there are Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): Other benefits that sometimes are not as well known that can kind of subsidize like paying down your debt. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): Or you know, helping you get to a financially secure place you know healthcare fully included, as opposed to having to pay for it out of your paycheck all these kinds of things are. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): Hidden things that you should really factor in when thinking about financial considerations, because it's not as just easy as going by salary. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: i'll speak a little bit to the student experience, and this was something that I vividly remember because I had you know, I was animal science, I was in CALS and most of the people that I was going to class with Stephanie McBath CALS '19: were either continuing on to vet school going home to run their family's farm or  going to go work in industry somewhere. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: And I was just sort of floating around like Okay, but I don't want to do any of that, and so I also, at the same time remember I had three of my best friends. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: Who are also in CALS in AIM, who were going to EY RBC and IBM, and they knew that in September right and i'm still out here interviewing until April and May. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: And that was really difficult, and I think my parents also had a moment of panic like okay why don't you actually have a job, yet. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: But I think you know, the thing that I always tried to tell myself was i'm not going to get out of college, with the same salary figures them. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: But I am going to like going to work every day, and I am going to be doing something that i'm passionate about and that to me at that time, certainly didn't mean that I needed to make a bunch of money. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: I still feel that way, no one goes into a government job because they want to make money right. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: So i've always tried to you know think that it's it's very easy the Cornell mentality to compare yourself to other people. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: is very easily something you can get caught up in and you don't need to do that, and you shouldn't do that because I think. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: Everyone has their own timelines and you're all learning the skills that you need to be successful, no matter what you do so, keep that in mind. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: But I certainly you know, there are some benefits to know Nageeb's point about you know my federal student loans were partially paid off because i'm a federal employee and that made a huge difference for me. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: Especially you know right out of college and you do move up and you find ways to stay competitive and you find ways to live in expensive cities, you know DC is not cheap, New York City is not cheap. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: There are ways that you can make it work because people have done it before you so. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: don't be afraid, at least for a while to pursue something that you're more passionate about even if you have to put some of your other financial priorities on the backburner as long as you can sustain I think. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: To me like I said it's always been really about the purpose and the paycheck will come if you are passionate about the purpose. George Hornedo: I think the. Mia Ferraina (she/her): Great alliteration  George Hornedo: I think the all- George Hornedo: The other thing that i'd. George Hornedo: want to add is that you know kind of like a Nageeb reference like. George Hornedo: You know your priorities will change, could change, over time for different reasons, as you enter different phases of life and this and that, and so you- you're. George Hornedo: You- you often will have the ability to pivot right, so you know, especially at this, I think the start of your career like Stephanie said, like pursue the passion and then you know. George Hornedo: It- things will work out from there, and you can kind of move from there, and then I also think you know, obviously, these sorts of decisions on oh what's the first job going to be it feels so. George Hornedo: You know determinative you know but it's not necessarily, right now. George Hornedo: You don't have to stay in that same lane, you don't have to stay in that same function, their abilities to kind of you know, move and change course, so you know that's another reason why I think that. George Hornedo: You know you don't necessarily have to put too much weight and stress on what that. George Hornedo: That move is and then you know also as others we see just on this panel there's so many different ways to- George Hornedo: to serve you know whether it's in government, you know whether it's nonprofit side you know from my perspective, right now, on the private side you know philanthropy etc, so there that goes back to like the pivoting  aspect so that'd be good thing. Mia Ferraina (she/her): yeah that's a great point too George. Mia Ferraina (she/her): I guess shameless plug for the career Center that you can still use career services as an alum, no matter how many years. Mia Ferraina (she/her): out, you are you're always welcome to come back and see us or give us a call. Mia Ferraina (she/her): So we're happy to help you make that change too like George is mentioning. If you maybe start private and want to go public or you are even just pivoting within the world of nonprofits  feel free. Mia Ferraina (she/her): To come back and we're happy to help you make that switch and I want to pause and see if there's any questions in the chat that Katie is getting directly or if you want to chime in and say anything, you or even Joyce. If anybody has two cents otherwise I will go on to the next question. Mia Ferraina (she/her): Okay. Katie Panczner: We have one question. Mia Ferraina (she/her): Oh great Katie Panczner: We have one question. Katie Panczner: Somebody would like to know if GPA matters in getting a job I think probably on a similar note, if you could talk about some of the skills that you gained as an undergrad whether those are hard or soft skills uh that helped you translate into the workplace. Mia Ferraina (she/her): i'll at least get us started and you all can talk about skills, I will say i've been reading a lot of articles lately about GPA not mattering nearly as much as skills. So hopefully that helps set up some of the Mia Ferraina (she/her): alumni answers  Stephanie McBath CALS '19: I can jump in on this one, I have never been asked what my GPA was. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: Even as an intern and i'm sure that's different for everybody, but you know I think first of all you're going to have a piece of paper that says cornell on it and that's a huge you know, plus sign for a lot of people. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: I would also say you know if you can have a certain GPA, but if you're. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: going to work in public service, one of the things we always ask our interns during the hiring process is Have you ever worked in customer service? Have you ever had. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: a job in the restaurant industry? Or anything like that, because honestly. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: that's day to day, sometimes you're putting out fires you're dealing with people who are equally as passionate as you, if not more, some days about something. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: And having those skills and those interpersonal skills and to be able to have a conversation with people and level with them on a relatable note, I think, is probably the most valuable thing. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: That i'm grateful that I think I was able to hone during my time at cornell and in the last couple of years, but. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: Really, you know you can make up for it in other areas, I was not the strongest student because I really didn't know what I wanted to do, and I think the extracurriculars and all the other things, the internships. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: I think, George mentioned that's a huge plus to your resume and it's not for my experience not purely based off of your GPA. Tory Bredt AAP '09: and New York state, at least for teachers to go into masters programs GPA does matter we're trying to change that on the legislative level so stay tuned. Tory Bredt AAP '09: And I really, really hope teacher preparation programs do change that I think that it's it's a detriment to our to our profession. Tory Bredt AAP '09: And I will say in terms of skills, I took a finance course honestly through the hotel school that I refer back to weirdly a lot. Tory Bredt AAP '09: And I know that's more knowledge and skills, but it really taught me a lot about Microsoft Office and just like excel and just being able to use all of those like technical skills that I think are really, really important for. Tory Bredt AAP '09: Both communication and just organization of information, so I would highly highly recommend that there's like a business computing course in the hotel school as well that I really liked and I that was. Tory Bredt AAP '09: That was probably- I still have my manual around here somewhere from that and I still use it like Excel has not changed that much. Tory Bredt AAP '09: I would recommend all of those things Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): yeah i'll reinforce that I think you know GPA, certainly, hopefully, hopefully isn't a deciding factor i've had the privilege of employing. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): and hiring many people in the last couple of years, and you know that's not a factor in my decision making, but I think. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): If GPA is not the deciding factor then what's a proxy, for you know you continuing to have impact, drive, show initiative. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): I think those are the things that you need to kind of underscore in a cover letter or somehow call it in your resume to show that you had the leadership skills and initiative to get. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): something done that otherwise was a problem or that was stuck, so I would just encourage you to think about what's that one thing that you kind of you rose above and. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): Without without your engagement or involvement it wouldn't have gotten done, I think that's really what employers are looking for is that, like hunger and drive and initiative. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): More than anything else. On skills, you know i'd say all of us, it seems to me on the panel have had have some experience. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): And you guys are all going to start an entry level job, where you gonna have a boss. That boss needs to be briefed on something. Typically that brief might come in the form of an oral brief or it might come in the form of written brief and so. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): I think seniors, in particular, you probably think that writing seminar from freshman year is so long ago. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): But I encourage you to continue to think about how to shore up your writing and analytical skills. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): In particular, to be able to synthesize information right 100 pages down into a page that you can present to your boss, so that they can digest it and be able to take action on it, I think. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): That it takes a certain level of writing skill to be able to synthesize and brief materials for principles. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): And I guarantee you all of you will have that experience set where you have to brief with written materials so kind of learn to hone that skill. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): You know, with- with continual like writing improvement and getting some support and Cornell because I think that that's going to serve you well. George Hornedo: yeah in terms of GPA, thank God it. George Hornedo: has not been a factor in my career or else I would not be employed um and you know, in the hiring that i've done. George Hornedo: You know it's not been anything that i've looked at, you know, for when I hire and when i've been hired what's mattered is kind of where i've worked before who i've worked for and those references right, you know, at the end of the day, you know. George Hornedo: All you have is your name and so anywhere that you go you want to put your best foot forward, you want to be a team player, you want to be a hard worker and you want to be. George Hornedo: You know, eager and earnest and and just do your best so so there's that from a skills perspective, one thing that I did. George Hornedo: Is through every single internship experience I was very intentional about. George Hornedo: Working in a different function, because it doesn't matter whether you go campaigns, government. George Hornedo: You know philanthropy you know, etc, you know there's always communications, you know there's always like finance or development there's always kind of the more. George Hornedo: Administrative you know scheduling or scheduling in advance, or that sort of piece, you know digital now obviously is is everywhere. George Hornedo: And the reason I did that was to get a sense of what I was good at you know what I actually enjoyed how a certain shop is run. George Hornedo: get a sense of what exit opportunities look like you know for people that you know work in certain spaces and. George Hornedo: All that to help me figure out, you know kind of what area I wanted to go in, but also so that, when I was looking for jobs, I could be a utility player and be able to. George Hornedo: To go as needed so, for example, when I was you know interviewing for the Obama Administration, because I had a lot of different functional experience, I was able to be considered for all sorts of different jobs. George Hornedo: Across all different agencies but across all different functions at that junior level, because I was able to speak towards prior experiences that lend itself well towards public affairs at DOJ right or you know briefing book it. George Hornedo: or HUD, or all these different pieces ledger affairs, etc, etc, and so that was helpful for me and also even to this day, even if it was just an internship I feel like it gives me. George Hornedo: The ability to see the bigger picture and working towards any mission as opposed to being very siloed and like what are the goals of a communication team within a campaign. George Hornedo: it's I know where the communication goal sits within the broader goal of the mission of a campaign right and so that that's something that I found helpful for me. Katie Panczner: OK, the next question I have for you is not necessarily every role in public service is political, but how do you find stability in a profession, with continuous turnover? Tory Bredt AAP '09: i'm laughing at that question because I feel like. Tory Bredt AAP '09: At least in New York, we have whenever there is a change in in government whenever there's a new mayor, at least in the Department of Education and a lot of city agencies there's a lot of turnover there's a lot of people who come in and a lot of people who leave. Tory Bredt AAP '09: And I think it's it's something that like. Tory Bredt AAP '09: And, and I am not in a political i'm not in a political position and I don't aspire to be. Tory Bredt AAP '09: But I think that it's very it's it's once you like, with all of that cross functional expertise that George was describing. Tory Bredt AAP '09: If you can become a generalist and really understand all of the different pieces and parts of an organization or or the government sector. Tory Bredt AAP '09: That is a skill in itself being able to get things done in the government sector is a skill and so the bureaucracy is real. So I would just say that it's something that no matter if your political or not, I think you, you have to sort of be willing to be flexible and deal with ambiguity. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: Sure, I can speak to this a little bit too, obviously. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: You know my bosses term is two years, this is a re-elect year. If it doesn't go well for us in November come January i'm looking for a different job right and that's the way that. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: the hill is. It's a revolving door of just young professionals, all the time, which is good in many ways, because normally That means that there's obviously going to be something open. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: You know I think we try to keep in mind every day that we come here, because the voters sent us here. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: And then, once we get here whether or not they voted for my boss, we represent them and that's something that you just have to. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: Bear in mind when you're making decisions or advising him on certain things, but it is difficult because you don't have very many people in. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: This setting I guess at least that have specific policy expertise in one area, we have to handle 12 or 15 different issues, every day and and yield questions and put out fires in those areas and so. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: That is one thing that I think, hopefully, the House now that they've increased the MRA they're going to try to keep people around. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: By increasing everyone salary, a little bit more and have more institutional knowledge, instead of people going to the private sector because they want to make more money. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: i'm hoping that trend continues, because I think that is one of the issues with government right now is the turnover is so high, every time there's a new administration, all of the agencies change there's all these confirmation hearings we're waiting on and it's just a process. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: And we just live with, but it is, it does keep things interesting i'll say you know you you work a little bit harder, knowing that you can maybe keep your boss here keep your job and keep the good work moving that that you want to do. George Hornedo: well- George Hornedo: As you say you know- George Hornedo: I would add while certainly. George Hornedo: there's instability from that perspective. But it's like people land, you know, like so it's- it's more that it's frustrating, it's more that it's the ambiguity and not knowing what that next move is, but like you'll land you'll be fine. Tory Bredt AAP '09: I was just going to comment to Katie's comment in the chat about unionization like that is something at least in New York City government. Tory Bredt AAP '09: A lot of our positions are Union positions we have very strong Union positions, and so, even though there's a lot of turnover, even though there's a lot of that happening. Tory Bredt AAP '09: Most of our employees are Unionized, and so it isn't that's why I think there's a lot of stability also. Tory Bredt AAP '09: In our in our offices unless someone wants to leave or is being pushed out, for whatever reason, and also like the private sector, as you know. Tory Bredt AAP '09: it's very it's very tempting sometimes when you see when you see some of the other opportunities out there, but I think you can keep a Stable, a very stable government job, especially because of the unions and they're very strong in New York. Katie Panczner: Okay, our next question someone wrote, how do I translate my value system into a tangible career, what does it actually look like finding a job that fits within a value system? Mia Ferraina (she/her): I think this one is tricky um if anyone wants to take a stab at answering it go for it, we have probably a few minutes left in this space, I will at least brought the say. Mia Ferraina (she/her): If you want to talk a little bit more intimately about like values and what fits with your particular goal career wise i'm happy to meet with you individually and kind of hash that out, obviously, everybody values different things, but. Mia Ferraina (she/her): certainly important to try and find something that. Mia Ferraina (she/her): feels aligned for you. Mia Ferraina (she/her): So you know i'll have to answer that one, but if anyone wants to chime in feel free. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): I mean, I would just say that you can be analytical even on the values kind of conversation and seeing how it aligns I sometimes when i'm looking at a new job opportunity right my top three values and score those job opportunities, based on those values right. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): So sometimes it's not as not as clear cut, but I think instinctively you probably know where- where you know one position or compares to another on on fulfilling those values. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): And maybe if you create that analytical exercise it might be helpful for you to kind of do some comparative analysis. Mia Ferraina (she/her): that's a great technique Nageeb thanks. Anybody else want to comment on that one, otherwise I have one last question. Mia Ferraina (she/her): looks like we're good okay um this last one I think a couple of you could speak to but um there's some folks wondering. Mia Ferraina (she/her): What is the the difference in working for nonprofit versus government? I think there are some people out there who are like I just care about this particular cause and i'm wondering what setting or environment I should choose to work towards that cause or work on that. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): yeah i'm happy to start and then let the panelists fill in I think you know, there are a couple of considerations to think about when you're thinking about government versus nonprofit. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): One I would say is scale of opportunity right, you know, being in public service and being in government, you probably you're often changing systems and scale. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): Sometimes there's complexity correlated with that, and so you know the particular issue that you're interested in, I would say kind of compare. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): If there's been movement in in kind of the government space versus the ability to make a difference on the nonprofit space that's certainly. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): One consideration, I think the other thing in the nonprofit space when you're thinking about direct service type of work. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): Some people get energized by kind of working with the people that they ultimately are seeking to help. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): Certainly there might be an opportunity in government to do that as well, but it may be a little bit, in my opinion, little there may be less frequency with that so. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): You might be one step removed from the ultimate people you're you're seeking to help so think about that as a consideration and what drives you and kind of energizes you. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): yeah and then I say that you know there's 1.8 million nonprofits in the US that's that's a lot of nonprofits to be choosing from right. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): Government, you can think about you know local regional. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): You know state federal. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): But there's there's so much diversity, even in the nonprofit sector itself, you can be working at a grassroots organization that only has you know, a couple hundred thousand revenue up to. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): organizations that are essentially doing fee for service activity for the government and feel like a government agency and so sometimes it's it's it's hard to compare so yeah just think about some of those considerations nonprofit versus versus government it's a good question. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: I can piggyback off of that for a second I think when I was an undergrad The one thing that I kept telling my advisor was that I wanted to affect change, but I didn't know in what way, I wanted to do that. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: And unfortunately, I chose the very long, hard process and and way of effecting change I think some days. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: It does take a long time when you're in the government, I mean, first of all, you have to work your way up to a certain level of credibility and. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: Your boss has to trust you and you're advising them to do certain things. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: And you can write bills and you can do all those things, but you know for us we're in the minority right now we don't have control over what bill comes to the floor, or what committee markup is held so. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: I think, keep in mind that there is the government's not going away, it will always be here, it will mostly if you want to work in the federal government it's going to be in DC you know where the rest of them are keep that in mind. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: But it's also been here and we're a deliberative body for a reason, and we have to abide by timelines and standards and rules that I think sometimes in the private sector, you can have a little bit more flexibility. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: You know my schedule itself is dictated by whether we have votes happening or not, and so forth, so. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: it's a little bit more regimented in some ways, and things change quickly here but that's just one thing to keep in mind that it's the government and it operates slowly and that's not always something that. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: As young people were super excited about but that's just unfortunately sometimes the way that it goes but it's a good thing in some ways too. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): it's a great thing to reinforce just another comparison Stephanie based on what you said is sometimes. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): This is, this is just a gross character characterization as a generalization but like government decision making might be considered kind of more top down, whereas nonprofit sector. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): You know bottoms up so in an early stage career, you might have more voice or agency in some decision making people like stephanie you know, have the benefit of working for someone that has influenced and so that's. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): kind of unique perk or position, but I think sometimes you should think definitely about the process of how the decision is making and whether or not your voice an agency and. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): kind of input will make a difference in the short, medium or long term I think it's a great point to racism longevity of time, as well as kind of where decision making lies. Mia Ferraina (she/her): yeah if you want to be the person really driving it that's very different than. Mia Ferraina (she/her): I want the stability of someone else like picking the heat and making the big decisions and i'll support them, so not necessarily that one is like right or wrong, but think about your personality and your style. Katie Panczner: We have one more question before we let students pick breakout rooms and once we get through this question students you have the option to enter any of those four breakout rooms. Katie Panczner: And before we get there, if you all could answer how students can or should leverage networking in getting a public service career? George Hornedo: it's everything. George Hornedo: You know, especially in you know I know a little bit less about kind of the nonprofit side of things, but. George Hornedo: At least I imagine stephanie will agree, like on the DC side and government campaigns etc so much as you know where you were before? Who you know? Who is able to speak towards you? Who's able to you know advocate for you? George Hornedo: I don't know the last time that i've gotten a job based off of like submitting a resume. George Hornedo: And that's just the reality, but it's you know your networks continue to grow, and I think one thing that's important. George Hornedo: Is. George Hornedo: is being. George Hornedo: There are people that will go out there and are just very transparent that they're just trying to meet everybody and talk to everybody and it just comes across as you know, disingenuous. George Hornedo: i've only ever really kind of whatever organic interactions and relationships that I build. George Hornedo: I do, I try and do as good a job, as I can, as maintaining them so it's not a here today gone tomorrow sort of relationship or relationship of convenience or me just reaching out to somebody when I need something. George Hornedo: But it's you know checking in every now and then hey i've read this article and made me think you know of you know, whatever you know. George Hornedo: There are people that I worked with from the White House that you know i'll still just talk to about whenever the pacers or sixers play because i'm a pacer Stan he's a six or stan right. George Hornedo: And we've never had to work together since, and now I brought him in as a client to the law firm for like federal fairs work right and so it's things like that that's how you. George Hornedo: You build and you grow, and you know people are able to serve as advocates and you never know who knows who right? And this world is a lot smaller than it seems. George Hornedo: When- when you enter a certain space and kind of goes back to what I said at the top about you know, at the end of the day, all you have is your name, and so you know. George Hornedo: Any experience that you go into make sure that you only put your best foot forward and try and be a hard worker, you know team player that. George Hornedo: you're not one of those people that's always gossiping or causing problems are involved in drama or things like that, because that's always going to be the case. It doesn't matter the work environment. And so just kind of always keep aboveboard. Tory Bredt AAP '09: I agree with that, I also think that, at least in New York City government and local government. Tory Bredt AAP '09: it's once you're in the government so once you have a position, usually a civil service position, so you have to take a test and i'm happy to talk about that with anybody offline but it's. Tory Bredt AAP '09: Once you're in it's all about the networks that you make within the government, especially if you want to work in a on a different project or, if you want to work in a different Office, if you want to change roles, if you want to be promoted to a different- Tory Bredt AAP '09: To a different role it's really important, not as much about going to like the networking opportunities as much as it is. Tory Bredt AAP '09: Having involvement and doing a really good job on whatever project you're in. So it's a lot about like oh your reputation is X, so we want that person to be part of our project because they're you know they have a great reputation to do this work well. Tory Bredt AAP '09: So I think that it's and and to echo George I think it's super important that whatever networking, whatever conversations, building those relationships, make sure it's authentic it's very, very easy to see through Tory Bredt AAP '09: When people just want to like chat with you for a job or like do they really want to get to know you and be part of your work and they're passionate about that work. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): yeah I agree with both what George and Tory said, and I would also say you never know where the next opportunity might lie right, you might be thinking that it's. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): You know, there are jobs or there are no jobs and a job will materialize based on the conversation right because they believe in you so never doubt that. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): I mean my i'm just reminded that my wife like got connected with someone, and you know. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): They had no idea why they were taking the meeting, and so, thankfully, she had to have like have your elevator pitch ready like who are you, and what are you interested in 60 seconds like practice it and that kind of opened the door for her. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): next day like they said Okay, we decided we need that kind of job on the Hill and we have some flexibility you're hired like. George Hornedo: To do. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): Afghanistan and Pakistan work on the hill so. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): Just you know know your pitch, even if you think it might not be a job opportunity you never know what's gonna what's going to come. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): You know, think about it as like How long does it take to go right up an elevator should be able to- you should be able to summarize for some of these people. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): You know who you are. What you believe in and what you want to do and how you're going to make a difference it's sometimes tough to do but and you never want to boil down like your whole experience of life [down] to that, but sometimes that's all it takes to get that opening. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: The only other thing I want to add to that is used the Cornell network, because I have found the world to be a much smaller place here in DC I know I have a lot of friends in New York, who have people in organizations everywhere. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: That went to Cornell I mean if I need something I have a senate office who I looked up his name on LinkedIn he happened to be a Cornell grad. That was my foot in the door, and some days that's all it takes, you know. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: they'll talk to you if you have a similar experience about a dining Hall, or something ridiculous like that, but it happens every week I find somebody that. Stephanie McBath CALS '19: Has a similar experience to me and just keep that in mind, you never know who you're going to come across and that family is a lot smaller than you think. Mia Ferraina (she/her): i'm also going to put a link to a networking platform that I think is really helpful for government, in particular, in the chat and it's called Leadership Connect we have a subscription through the Cornell library so. Mia Ferraina (she/her): If you access it through you know login to the library look it up you'll be able to access that for free, and I think is a really helpful tool to see who is where, in government, and you can filter by who is the Cornell Grad if you want. Mia Ferraina (she/her): So I think at this point we're going to allow you guys to pick your breakout room and you'll get to choose from any of. Mia Ferraina (she/her): These lovely panelists. Mia Ferraina (she/her): Who you'd like to get to know a little bit better great opportunity to practice your networking right now, so I will open these up probably about 25-30 minutes or so um, so I will open these, and you can go ahead and choose who you'd like to talk with. Nageeb Sumar (A&S, AAP, '01): Mia, are you hoping we all come back after that or is that kind of just the end. Mia Ferraina (she/her): It will automatically close and you'll come back here and we'll just wrap up. Mia Ferraina (she/her): But um I hope everyone had a good conversation in the breakout rooms i'd love to hear a little bit more about it in the chat if you want to. Mia Ferraina (she/her): Type a lesson learned or a great topic of conversation you had, but I will also be blowing up the chat myself with some links and resources for you all that I think will be helpful. Mia Ferraina (she/her): Broadly, I think, certainly our websites and instagrams from both the career services office, as well as. Mia Ferraina (she/her): Einhorn Center are both really useful. So our tags they're pretty straightforward but i'll put those in the chat there for you. Um I think Katie and I were chatting and some of the other. Mia Ferraina (she/her): Resources, we wanted to share with you or just ways of gaining either experience and or finding funding to support an experience that you've already been pursuing. So i'll put in the chat some other links, so the public service Center now Einhorn Center. Mia Ferraina (she/her): Has a few different awards that I just linked to that general page there in the chat for you, if you have not heard of the summer experience grant that's also great open to students in all colleges definitely a lot of funding for art students but there's the link for SCG. Mia Ferraina (she/her): As well as if you have work, study, a great way, to use your work study off campus is through the Community work study program and that would be with like a local municipality or a nonprofit. Mia Ferraina (she/her): There are some pretty consistent like long term partners, but if there was something you wanted to see you might be able to work with Nicole and set that up to so. Mia Ferraina (she/her): drop that in there for you. Joyce Muchan: Just real quick. Mia Ferraina (she/her): just go ahead. Joyce Muchan: that's nationally Community work, study, can be national Nicole does it's not just the local community can be national so it could be something in somebody's community and maybe that's what you were saying, but yeah. Mia Ferraina (she/her): yeah I think there's lots of different options and. Mia Ferraina (she/her): Sometimes the regulations change from year to year, so double check with Nicole if you're interested in Community work study but bottom line definitely um. Mia Ferraina (she/her): and earn summer work study  that way, which is really nice if you want to do that. We talked a little bit about networking a few different ways and times. Mia Ferraina (she/her): Like I mentioned Leadership Connect I think is a great one more broadly, but CUeLINKS is also Cornell specific networking platform, which is how we found some of these wonderful panelists as well. Mia Ferraina (she/her): Thanks to Katie's sleuthing  so CUeLINKS is probably a smaller Community than what you would see on LinkedIn but alumni specifically sign up there, because they want. Mia Ferraina (she/her): To help students. So that can be a really great place to start if you're a little nervous to start networking, it gives you some templates of what to say even. Mia Ferraina (she/her): Though that's that's a helpful tool, I think the last. Mia Ferraina (she/her): thing i'm saying question mark. this last canvas link here is our career development toolkit from the Career Services Office, this is like a good one stop shop of. Mia Ferraina (she/her): Any career topic, you might want to learn about and get started on available to you 24 seven in your canvas hub like where all of your class stuff is. Mia Ferraina (she/her): it's a great place to get started or draft a document and then you're always obviously welcome to meet with us to talk more, and so, if there's any like lingering questions or thanks to Caroline putting a lesson learned in the chat so continue doing that and i'm just going to. Mia Ferraina (she/her): Put a link for a feedback survey in the chat and. Mia Ferraina (she/her): See if Katie has any final parting thoughts. Katie Panczner: I just want to thank our alumni for donating their time to us this evening, it has actually been so invaluable and we are so lucky to have you speak with us. Mia Ferraina (she/her): Thank you, big virtual round of applause thanks for that little emojis I some Mia Ferraina (she/her): People throwing out. There is your feedback form. Mia Ferraina (she/her): And if you want to book an appointment i'll put the link down there too because I forgot about that. Mia Ferraina (she/her): So lots of different tools at your disposal, but i'm really glad you all came tonight, and thank you so much to our alumni for your time and energy and efforts, we appreciate your wisdom.